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The 'Never Say You've Seen It All' Thread

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1 hour ago, Erwin said:

However, threatened the west may have felt, the Soviets had our missiles aimed at them from our bases in Turkey.  The Soviets' Cuba gambit was to equalize that.  Arguably it was successful (on the part of the Soviets)... as part of the deal, Kennedy had the Turkish missiles removed.  

In at least one account of the incident that I came across, Kennedy was shown saying that he had ordered the removal of the Turkish based missiles a year earlier and demanding to know why the Pentagon had been slow to act on that order.

Michael

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5 hours ago, Michael Emrys said:

In at least one account of the incident that I came across, Kennedy was shown saying that he had ordered the removal of the Turkish based missiles a year earlier and demanding to know why the Pentagon had been slow to act on that order.

Michael

I heard he secretly agreed to Soviet demands to remove the missiles from Turkey as a means to get the Soviets to abandon Cuba.

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16 hours ago, General Jack Ripper said:

I heard he secretly agreed to Soviet demands to remove the missiles from Turkey as a means to get the Soviets to abandon Cuba.

Yeah, that version goes around too. It would be nice to nail down just what the truth is in this matter.

The implications are historically serious. Your version suggests that the deal was stage managed to make the US look tough. The other version raises questions about the Pentagon chiefs' loyalty to the President as Commander in Chief.

Michael

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On 2/8/2019 at 12:02 PM, Michael Emrys said:

In at least one account of the incident that I came across, Kennedy was shown saying that he had ordered the removal of the Turkish based missiles a year earlier and demanding to know why the Pentagon had been slow to act on that order.

Is there documentation for this, Michael?  Evidence?  Or just vague rumors/"accounts" that could simply be face-saving PR - like "the US has never lost a war" etc.

If no evidence, (and one would think that there would be written documents released by now since what's the risk?) then the only thing we know is true is that after Cuba was defused, the US removed missiles from Turkey.   Unless there is hard evidence to the contrary, the facts support a success for "Crush-chev".

It was short-lived success of course, since a few year later the US won the space race, and later (so it's rumored) the CCCP disintegrated.

 

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1 hour ago, Erwin said:

Is there documentation for this, Michael?  Evidence?

I don't know. Having lived through that very intense period was enough for me and I haven't felt motivated to sort through the thousands of documents that it generated. I do recall that some time in the last year or two that the BACM (archivist@paperlessarchives.com) released a huge stack of such documents.

Michael

Edited by Michael Emrys

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I understand.  Am simply saying that there would be many folks out there with an axe to grind to either rewrite history or correct it.  And nothing has emerged.  So all we know is what we know for a fact happened.

 

Edited by Erwin

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General Jack Ripper,

This may be the worst screwup of this type in the history of the US military. Never have I come across anything remotely like it. All the worse that the Air force Chief of Staff did it and on a global broadcast! Am going to have to have all my neck bearings replaced from the head shaking this has engendered.

Regards,

John Kettler

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Transcripts of what JFK said ref tying Jupiter missile removals from Turkey to getting Russian MRBMs out of Cuba were released in 1987 and discussed in WaPo at link. He did link the one to the other, but his advisers explicitly asked him not to do so.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1987/10/22/transcript-confirms-kennedy-linked-removal-of-missiles-in-cuba-turkey/1596db24-709f-453d-87df-dede2e19b17c/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.87017613ee96
 

Regards,

John Kettler

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Of course these days it's not so easy to tell:

Are there any old abandoned shipping containers in Venezuela, I wonder?  :P

PS - The treaty that just got abandoned means that thing can now have missiles with 1500km+ range (rather than the current 300km) and nuclear warheads (rather than HE), all completely legally.  ;)

Edited by Sgt.Squarehead

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7 hours ago, John Kettler said:

This looks like something the Monty Python boys would've come up with, had they the tech. Anyone recognize these guys?

tumblr_pj6j6i5go81s7cb45_1280.jpg

In this photo released by the official Xinhua news agency, members of China's armed police demonstrate a rapid deployment during an anti-terrorist drill held in Jinan, east China, on Wednesday July 2, 2008, roughly one month ahead of the Beijing Olympic Games.

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Ref above pic, find the backdrop, a big photo of what looks to me to be an airliner fuselage for plane storming, training to be of interest. Am of the opinion, these guys are Spec Ops of some sort, but not necessarily military per se.

Regards,

John Kettler

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By Jove from 2002–2016 Jeremy Clarkson. Richard Hammond & James May were shape shifting super secret Sec Ops and/or nefarious neo-Nazis of some sort!... indisputable evidence below.

Image%2525202019-02-13%252520at%2525207.

Image%2525202019-02-13%252520at%2525207.

Image%2525202019-02-13%252520at%2525207.

Image%2525202019-02-13%252520at%2525207.

 

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Wicky,

That's quite the collection you've got there, with the guy on the Segway being the weirdest by far. A more bizarre collection of wildly disparate elements, be it the man or the story, would be difficult to imagine. Also, always thought Druids were confined to Britain and immediate surrounds on that side of the Channel.

Andy,

Thanks for IDing the Segway mounted assault force.

Michael Emrys,

Definitely not an IS-2. The tank portion of Wicky's montage shows a turret without the distinctive armored lip atop and extending from the roof armor and over the mantlet proper. Concur with Andy and believe it's a T-34/85, a conclusion reinforced by the distinctive shape and left side position of the Driver-Mechanic's hatch.

JS2_unknonw.jpg

Image Credit: 1945 Russian wartime photo via Tanks Encyclopedia.com

Regards,

John Kettler

 

Edited by John Kettler

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3 hours ago, Sgt.Squarehead said:

I thought T-34/85, but you could be right.....Either way, it ain't German. 

That crossed my mind too. I wish I still had my photo books of Soviet tanks. The shape of the turret hatch could be the clincher.

Michael

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This is a first for me, and it's gorgeous. Am no astrologer, but this is definitely an astrological device, and I believe it's a calendar which shows what's where and when so that horoscopes may be generated. Looks like it's in Praha or somewhere in that general region.

tumblr_mj1pmsk7Ce1s43hx9o1_500.jpg

This, on the other hand, would've freaked me out had I seen it when a little boy!

tumblr_ovx1smKeqx1qb4ewmo1_500.jpg

Four days accumulation of freezing rain have brought down the mighty metal giants near

Montreal in  Boucherville, Canada, January 9, 1998.

Image Credit: Photo by Robert Laberge, via  archives


tumblr_linyi3W8LR1qakafjo1_r1_500.png

Regards,

John Kettler

Edited by John Kettler

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