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VasFURY

Moscow Victory Day (70 Years) Parade

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I am pretty sure you didn't mean it quite as all encompassing as it sounds but I have to ask.

 

Probably, yeah. I didn't mean "one can't", I meant he shouldn't, because it's impractical. But if one can and wants to have fun, why the hell not. I'm just sharing experience, because I had to go through a lot of such discussions over the past 1.5 years (and not just the ones you saw me in).

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VERY important thing I've learned over the past 1.5 years is: One should not tell people from other places about what's wrong with their counties. People have to discuss their internal problems with their own. That's the most productive and most useful activity politics discussion wise.

 

There's a difference between calling a steaming pile a feces and picking it up yourself.  The observation it's a steaming pile of feces is anyone's right to make.  Scooping it off your lawn is your business.

 

So in that regard if you LIKE the feces and expect me to come over to visit while it's still sitting on your lawn, I'm not going to engage with you.  If you start putting your feces on my lawn though, then we're going to have a fight on our hands.

 

Which is pretty much my take on international affairs in a nutshell. 

 

 

 

As an American I am pretty used to people telling me what is wrong with my country, and sometimes, even frequently they are right.  Earlier in this thread someone reverenced George Bush Jr as one of the stupidest presidents ever.  I wasn't about to disagree and I don't take offense.  I don't have a problem with folks criticizing my country.  Sometimes I'll agree, sometimes I won't. There is certainly nothing about a national border that makes their observations somehow irrelevant or unhelpful.

 

I don't have a problem either.  Sometimes there's a point to it.  Other times its a good chance for mutual education.  Others, it's just an amazing chance for me to have a laugh at how much outsiders think they know about America.  

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There's a difference between calling a steaming pile a feces and picking it up yourself.  The observation it's a steaming pile of feces is anyone's right to make.  Scooping it off your lawn is your business.

 

So in that regard if you LIKE the feces and expect me to come over to visit while it's still sitting on your lawn, I'm not going to engage with you.  If you start putting your feces on my lawn though, then we're going to have a fight on our hands.

 

Which is pretty much my take on international affairs in a nutshell.

 

Yeah, and as I've said on the previous page, if you're telling a person that there's a pile on his lawn, while riding a white horse that drops piles underneath as it goes, it doesn't smell good. Unless it's a Captain Obvious cosplay contest or something. And value of such discussion violently approaches zero. Especially after the point when you both just start throwing those piles at each other.

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OK, I think now is as good a time as any to close lock this thread. No doubt another will eventually replace it, which is why I didn't close this up earlier. Sometimes it seems pointless :D The only way to really keep a lid on this is to be a Stalin like moderator. That involves banning people in huge numbers without caring much about what they are saying, only that they are saying something :D

I'll end by just saying what should be obvious. Every country has a mix of good and bad people, which means it produces a mix of good and bad outcomes domestically and internationally. People who try to view things in absolutes inherently have an oversimplified understanding of the world. People who try to excuse bad outcomes in one place because there were bad outcomes in another place are inherently apologists. People who view the world's people and outcomes in relative terms are by definition more balanced in their thinking and it's why they don't get along very well in discussions with absolutists and apologists. We always have a mix of the three (and occasionally "justifiers", which are beneath contempt IMHO) to keep things "interesting".

Final thought. The only example in history that comes even close to matching the power and influence of the United States is that of Rome. But not very closely as the United States has far more power and influence than Rome ever did in absolute terms. The period of history that followed the decline and fall of Rome is called "The Dark Ages". For those of you thinking that the US failing is a good thing should ponder what historians will call the fall of the US empire. Then think if you really want to experience that.

Steve

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