Alexey K Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 So far I don't quite get one thing. How information exchange between units affect spotting and reaction times. For example, enemy tank is spotted by scout sqad and my own tank is hiding behind something. How exactly my tank is taking into account data about spotted enemy tank? Or the only way to exploit that knowledge is to manually set targeting arc for my tank? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieme(ITA) Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 (edited) Depends on the position of the scout team and of the tank in the chain of command. In the best possible situation, when selecting your tank: the enemy tank -which is directly seen by the scout team- will turn into a ? icon for an enemy vehicle or even a tank, with no fading. So, your tank crew will know that there's a tank there, but until they don't see it directly you won't get any different command/capability. In your specific example the scout team might get the information up to the chain of command, and such information might get down to that tank of yours. But even if the information is perfectly shared your tank will still need to see the enemy with its own eyes before taking appropriate action. Let's say that all this is more for your own benefit than for your troops on the ground; as you said, it's up to you to set up an appropriate cover arc, or act in another way, thanks to the information you have collected. Another example: you have an ATGM team without binoculars, attached to it there's its own platoon HQ. Suppose they are in the same position, top of a building. It's quite probable that the HQ unit will spot an enemy tank hiding somewhere first, thanks to its binocs. Then the information will be shared in a matter of few seconds, and this will make sure that your ATGM team will also spot that enemy unit in less time than they would have required if they were alone. Be careful, there is Always a delay, sometime you'll select a team that will show on the map ? icons that were good several turns/minutes before, while another unit will give you a more recent situation. Delay in information sharing depends on many factors, not all accounted in the manuals etc., I'm pretty sure that the availability of special communication equipment and position in the chain of command are the most important elements, remember that the information need to go up the chain of command and then down again, before it's available from one extreme low to the other. All of these informations are yours to decide how to filter, and recognize old news from fresh information. Edited April 23, 2015 by Kieme(ITA) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spycossomatik Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 (edited) If an unit is enough close to another one (voice distance) but they are not in the same company (or section), will they share informations about what they are seeing directly? (Sorry for my english ^^) Edited April 23, 2015 by Spycossomatik 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 If an unit is enough close to another one (voice distance) but they are not in the same company (or section), will they share informations about what they are seeing directly? (Sorry for my english ^^) Yes, although they have to be fairly close to each other. I have tested it out to 3 action spot (about 24 meters). The closer they are the faster the information is shared. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexey K Posted April 23, 2015 Author Share Posted April 23, 2015 Thank you for answers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antaress73 Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 I ve done it many times in WWII titles , infantry detecting tanks then sending then near m'y own tanks and tell them where to look.. Gives them a spotting bonus. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longle1 Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 Yes, although they have to be fairly close to each other. I have tested it out to 3 action spot (about 24 meters). The closer they are the faster the information is shared. Is this a new feature in Black Sea? I don't think I can do the same thing in Shock Force, i.e. information sharing is strictly for units under the same HQ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antaress73 Posted April 23, 2015 Share Posted April 23, 2015 You need a higher HQ for info sharing between units with different lower order HQs 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Ausf B Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 Is this a new feature in Black Sea? Not at all. I tested it several years ago in CM Normandy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spycossomatik Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 Thank you for hell 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOS:96B2P Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 If an unit is enough close to another one (voice distance) but they are not in the same company (or section), will they share informations about what they are seeing directly? Yes, although they have to be fairly close to each other. I have tested it out to 3 action spot (about 24 meters). The closer they are the faster the information is shared. You need a higher HQ for info sharing between units with different lower order HQs This is an interesting topic. So, just to clarify. My understanding is that units need the same higher HQ to share ammo. I am not so sure if they need the same higher HQ to share information. Will a fire team from 1st Infantry Battalion share information with a fire team from 2nd Armored Infantry Battalion if they are in adjacent action spots? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 My understanding is that units need the same higher HQ to share ammo. The same immediately higher HQ, yes; it's a good approximation of a true statemet. There's a proviso that the HQs of different platoons cannot share with one another, just because their next immediately higher HQ is the Coy actual. The easiest determinant is whether they highlight when you select one (so: all the elements of a platoon; the elements of a company or battalion HW detachment - the XO team, the Coy HQ themselves, any drivers or attached teams like AT or MG). Will a fire team from 1st Infantry Battalion share information with a fire team from 2nd Armored Infantry Battalion if they are in adjacent action spots? As I understand it, yes. And even without the Bttn HQs being on map, information will eventually trickle up to then down from 1Inf Bttn, via 2AInf Bttn to the squad in 2AInf. I don't even know for sure if it'll be slower than if the two Bttn commanders are in radio contact. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOS:96B2P Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 The same immediately higher HQ, yes; The easiest determinant is whether they highlight when you select one. Thanks. That is a good way to tell. I will have to remember that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOS:96B2P Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 As I understand it, yes. And even without the Bttn HQs being on map, information will eventually trickle up to then down from 1Inf Bttn, via 2AInf Bttn to the squad in 2AInf. Oops. I may have given Kieme(ITA) some bad information in a different topic. The link is below. http://community.battlefront.com/topic/119247-advantages-of-having-higher-command-on-the-ground/ I thought if two units (fire teams, platoons, etc...) were over Vanir's stated three action spots apart they would only be able to share information with each other through the chain of command. Example: 1st platoon, Alfa Company 2nd Battalion spots an OpFor tank platoon on the left flank. This information would go up an unbroken C2 chain and back down to 2nd Platoon, Bravo Company 2nd Battalion on the right flank. If the Bn HQ was destroyed (along with the XO team for this example) the information between companies in the battalion could not be relayed via the C2 chain. If after the destruction of the Battalion HQ the surviving Company HQs moved to within three action spots of each other the C2 information sharing between companies could resume??? But maybe I was wrong................. I guess when I get a chance I should try to test some of this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieme(ITA) Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 You owe me a few points worth of quick battle... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOS:96B2P Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 You owe me a few points worth of quick battle... Yes, I think I might. I have not had a chance to test if the Battalion HQ has to be on the map for the subordinate companies HQs (separated by more than three action spots) to share information. I sometimes miss the nuances of a conversation when it is not face to face but I am pretty sure womble was saying the Bn HQ does not have to be on the map. I don't ever remember womble being wrong about game mechanics (I sometimes suspect womble is a covert forum name for Charles ) But I will run a few tests just for my own understanding and of course for the fun of it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieme(ITA) Posted April 25, 2015 Share Posted April 25, 2015 No problem. I like the idea of using a Btn HQ if not just for the good sake of a complete and realistic force. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
womble Posted April 26, 2015 Share Posted April 26, 2015 Yes, I think I might. I have not had a chance to test if the Battalion HQ has to be on the map for the subordinate companies HQs (separated by more than three action spots) to share information. I sometimes miss the nuances of a conversation when it is not face to face but I am pretty sure womble was saying the Bn HQ does not have to be on the map. I don't ever remember womble being wrong about game mechanics (I sometimes suspect womble is a covert forum name for Charles ) But I will run a few tests just for my own understanding and of course for the fun of it. Thanks for the complement, but I am certainly not an infallible source. I try and keep it straight in my head, but I do misremember sometimes. I can categorically refute the suspicion of being a sockpuppet for Charles: Brains In Jars have much better things to do with their time than respond to what's going on here, I'm sure! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOS:96B2P Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 I finally got around to doing some experimenting with C2 and information sharing. The results are posted in the below link and include lots of screen shots. http://community.battlefront.com/topic/119474-c2-information-sharing/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xIGuNDoCIx Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Very cool MOS! Nice job and very informative! It would be interesting to see something like this done for CMBS with all the squad radios etc. Also it would be nice to see the C2 difference between nations. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sburke Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Thanks for the complement, but I am certainly not an infallible source. I try and keep it straight in my head, but I do misremember sometimes. I can categorically refute the suspicion of being a sockpuppet for Charles: Brains In Jars have much better things to do with their time than respond to what's going on here, I'm sure! The brain in the jar also has no hands to manipulate the sock puppet. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fry30 Posted May 7, 2015 Share Posted May 7, 2015 Another example: you have an ATGM team without binoculars, attached to it there's its own platoon HQ. Suppose they are in the same position, top of a building. It's quite probable that the HQ unit will spot an enemy tank hiding somewhere first, thanks to its binocs. Then the information will be shared in a matter of few seconds, and this will make sure that your ATGM team will also spot that enemy unit in less time than they would have required if they were alone. This, right here, says it all. You need to keep everyone within C&C (&C&C) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delliejonut Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Hey, check this out. Someone did some spotting research and recently posted on the CMBN forum. Good info on there C2 thread 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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