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Lee_Vincent

Armata soon to be in service.

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I don't see anything wrong with them using such clips. They're describing modern dangers to armored vehicles. I hope they'd tell us about APS. The show starts in 5 minutes (9.55 MSK), you can watch the stream here

 

http://www.glaz.tv/online-tv/zvezda

or

http://tvzvezda.ru/schedule/

 

whichever works. Latter doesn't work for me, so I give you the alternative.

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I don't see anything wrong with them using such clips. They're describing modern dangers to armored vehicles. I hope they'd tell us about APS. The show starts in 5 minutes (9.55 MSK), you can watch the stream here

 

http://www.glaz.tv/online-tv/zvezda

or

http://tvzvezda.ru/schedule/

 

whichever works. Latter doesn't work for me, so I give you the alternative.

Ah see without the luxury of understanding the commentary, it only looks like (to me and I imagine others) that they were claiming it was a Russian missile.  If they're simply commenting on the lethality of modern ATGMs then it's all well and good.

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Oh well. I expected to see more. The whole show was more like a trolling of foreign intel services. They haven't said a single word about APS, but showed those top-attack clips. They showed two armor plating tests, main armor vs 12.7 and 7.62, and the smaller one that comes with floating add-on side panels vs 5.45. Considering that even BMP-3's front can withstand 30mm, these tests are nothing interesting to look at. Anyways, here's the summary.

 

  • 3 crew, 7 passengers;
  • Kurg chassis is intended for: IFV, APC, SAM/AA, REPAIR/EVAC, C3 (Command, Control, Comms);
  • Automatic transmission gear box, 6 forward 3 backwards, backwards 20kph;
  • Water jets like on BMP-3/BMD-4, 10kph in the water;
  • Changeable clearance (delta 0.5m);
  • Shares engine with Boomerang, but can be installed with Armata's engine if needed;
  • 8 observation cameras, 360 degrees coverage;
  • Can be fitted with Nakidka camo;
  • Two types of side panels: 1) floats+armor plate; 2) ERA (most likely from BMP-3M, ie 2S24, 500mm RHA, 30kg per block);
  • Anti-mine system against mines with electromagnetic fuse, like installed on tanks;
  • Turret can rotate endlessly (no gimbal limit);
  • Datalink, external guidance, target locator and auto tracking.

 

Not sure if I missed anything. Gotta look at HD footage to see more details (like HUD UI, etc). Here's low-res recording, waiting for them to upload youtube version.

http://telepoisk.com/peredacha-tv-archiv/586188192/6-9-2015

Edited by L0ckAndL0ad

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Considering that even BMP-3's front can withstand 30mm, these tests are nothing interesting to look at. Anyways, here's the summary.

 

 

Not in this game it cant matey.

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Considering that even BMP-3's front can withstand 30mm, these tests are nothing interesting to look at. Anyways, here's the summary.

 

I was doing a little digging around to find verification of that and I could not.  What I found indicated that the turret seems should be able to but the references I found say the front armour can only handle 14.7mm and one place had a comment about it being able to handle 20mm.  I'm no expert by any means but can you point me to the data about the front armour you are looking at (even Russian would be fine).

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Yeah, the claim has been made alot, but is it possibly some sort of mistranslation?  The armor thickness is 30-35mm apparently, with a special setup/spaced armor on the turret (from what I was told).  Angle depending, wouldnt that be penetrable by most projectiles of the claimed caliber?  Angle of course being a key factor.

Edited by Nerdwing

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#true, 40MM HEDP penetrates my BMP-3Ms front turret in this game. 

 

Well, the 40mm HEDP ammo is supposed to be able to penetrate 50mm of armour.  The listing I have found the for the turret armour of a BMP3 is 30-35mm so no problem for the HEDP.  Am I looking at the wrong data for the BMP3?  Please point me in the "right" direction.

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Well, the 40mm HEDP ammo is supposed to be able to penetrate 50mm of armour.  The listing I have found the for the turret armour of a BMP3 is 30-35mm so no problem for the HEDP.  Am I looking at the wrong data for the BMP3?  Please point me in the "right" direction.

 

First, there's a ticket on BFC's bug tracker, submitted by Dima, quite some time ago, with pics and details.

 

Second, this: http://btvt.narod.ru/raznoe/vbtt_1991_bmp31.htm

 

There are at least 3 alloys used in BMP-3's armor: BT-70Sh (БТ-70Ш, steel), ABT-102 (АБТ-102, aluminum), AMG-6 (АМГ-6, also aluminum). The best one is ABT-102. 43mm of ABT-102 = 21mm of BT-70Sh, but with 25% weight advantage in favor of ABT-102. Said 43mm and 21mm respectively defeat 30mm AP-T (for 2A42) at 300 meters, at 68 degrees. Aluminum alloy is better than steel at more than 45 degrees deflection.

 

I'll translate the relevant part:

 

1 - upper front hull, 18mm ABT-102 (almost flat)

2 - side front hull, 60mm ABT-102

3 - turret front, 16mm BT-70Sh + 70mm air gap + 50mm ABT-102

5, 9 - turret and hull sides - 43mm ABT-102

12 - lower front hull, 10mm BT-70Sh + 70mm air gap + 60mm ABT-102

13 - middle front hull, 10mm BT-70Sh + 70mm air gap + 12mm BT-70Sh + 60mm ABT-102

 

image001.jpg

In most sources it is stated that BMP-3 is protected against 30mm AP-T at 200 meters, on the front. Note that it's 90's Soviet ammo, which isn't as good as modern stuff.

 

ADDED:

 

Also, there's a self-sealing fuel tank in the front, which is intended as last ditch stopping measure (# 31):

 

BMP-3.png

Edited by L0ckAndL0ad

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Thanks L0ckAndL0ad

 


That's more like it.
 

1 - upper front hull, 18mm ABT-102 (almost flat)
<snip>
3 - turret front, 16mm BT-70Sh + 70mm air gap + 50mm ABT-102

 
So looks like the turret front should be enough but that upper deck would be something that those high flying grenades might hit on their way down.
 

In most sources it is stated that BMP-3 is protected against 30mm AP-T at 200 meters, on the front. Note that it's 90's Soviet ammo, which isn't as good as modern stuff.

 
Yeah, I was wondering about that.  I kept seeing that statement thrown in but with no details which made me suspicious - hence was I was looking for data.

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Yeah, high flying 40mm HEDP grenades might turn ugly for that 18mm flat front.

Anyways, next stop - September 17th, with the same show, but this time about Armata series. Maybe they'll throw in some info during RAE-2015 (Sep 9-12), but I doubt it.

 

ADDED:

 

Oh, well, apparently, they've started teasing Armata episode. No actual teaser vids posted that I can see, but someone took that shot with Zvezda's logo, so it must have come from the stream:

 

LdhZv.jpg

Edited by L0ckAndL0ad

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It's funny that they've just posted those teaser clips in actual 720p, and not that bad quality that the full video was posted with. So here they are, for those who wants more quality in the most important parts:

 

 

 

What I've noticed so far. Observation monitor in crew compartment had several UI elements that weren't shown in action, but I can bet they are "4 in 1 mode", and "Turret's/Gun view feed". Should be quite useful for situational awareness. Also 30mm gun is kinda shaky when firing. I expected more stability.

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I don't really like to mass-post like this, but I know you wanted to see Armata firing for quite a while, so..

 

TWJdy.png

 

Also, Armata-based БРЭМ (armored repair & evac vehicle):

 

Xmfr3.png

 

ps: still no idea where this comes from, nothing on Zvezda's site in teaser section

 

ADDED:

 

Okay, confirmed that it comes from on-line stream. Here's the short ad video from it:

 

http://sendvid.com/u30t7c5g

Edited by L0ckAndL0ad

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What I found interesting are the multiple cameras for situational awareness and the huge screen (western sized) for the thermal imager. The screens on the catherine FC were pretty small (on the order of 3 times as small)  which would explain the delay in spotting for russian stuff. With such big screens it should be much easier and faster to spot and identify and could cut 50% on the time to spot for the kurganets compared to actual russian vehicules in the game. There a whole segment where the host is playing with the thermals and it seems pretty good. What do panzer think about the quality of the thermals ? The guy could read a license plate. It starts at 31:39 here. There's another segment (thermal screen) where he shoots at a van at 34:06.

 

Edited by antaress73

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From what I've seen, Kurg's and Boomerang's thermals are "2nd gen", while Armata's are "3rd gen". At least that's what on the descriptions. 3rd gen one looks almost identical to Catherine-XP
 
b4084e2f3cdd.png

ps: Armata episode should be out this Sunday, actually. They've messed up with schedule date

Edited by L0ckAndL0ad

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 I found them very good at least at the ranges shown in the video. The armata should then be even better. Adding all the cameras for situational awareness I think kurganets could be in the same spotting class as the Bradley in-game.

Edited by antaress73

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Ahh, that picture of the T-14 firing sure does make me feel all warm and fuzzy inside - especially remembering all the doomsaying on this thread and on the other 100+ page thread about the platform.

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Ahh, that picture of the T-14 firing sure does make me feel all warm and fuzzy inside - especially remembering all the doomsaying on this thread and on the other 100+ page thread about the platform.

Your selective memory is showing again :D Nobody posting on this Forum has doubted that Armata development would continue and that it will eventually progress to the production stage. So what's been shown here is not only unsurprising, it's expected.

The primary doubt is about its affordability with a secondary doubt about it's true battlefield performance. Pretty videos of big boom-booms doesn't do anything to put to rest either set of doubts. If you don't remember why, then maybe I should repost the awesome LOSAT test video as a reminder? ;)

Personally, I'm still speculating that it will go into small scale production more-or-less on time (+2 years), but will be slowly introduced over a long period of time and won't exceed perhaps 30% of Russia's tank force even as late as 20 years from now. I also expect that at some point we'll start figuring out what the "warts" of the system are since, currently, all we're getting is rah-rah type information (i.e. nothing critical). No design is perfect.

Steve

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