Free Copy AAR: DMS vs c3k.

[DMS]

2 M1s again are coming to HQ positions.

 

 

I am ready to meet them! HQ team will try to use salvo firing. 3 AT-4 in one second. Will APS intercept it?

 

 

And thanks to our driver - comrade Poore! He is an American communist.

[agusto]

The poor Poore...may he die a glorious death! And what about IanL, DMS? Is he still alive?

[Zveroboy1]

 

 

c3k set his M1 on the bridge so I wouldn't order Su-25s to attack it. He has taken hostage... A bridge!

 

 

:lol:

[Denis1973]

Destroying the bridge = he who destroyed it looses.  According to the rules   Ken took some creative licence with creating this scenario.

Yes, my fault to carefully read rules. BUT! It say that lost that which ammo destroyed the bridge, right? But how to decide if something from air hit and kill Abrams and it EXPLODED. Is that only AS rocket or Abrams ammo caused??

[DMS]

The poor Poore...may he die a glorious death! And what about IanL, DMS? Is he still alive?

 

He is waiting for his fate with AT-4 near HQ positions.

M1 wounded his assistant on the roof, but he is safe on the 1st floor.

M1s are near. What will they do?

 

Yes, my fault to carefully read rules. BUT! It say that lost that which ammo destroyed the bridge, right? But how to decide if something from air hit and kill Abrams and it EXPLODED. Is that only AS rocket or Abrams ammo caused??

 

"Oh, if that one bridge gets destroyed, then whoever's ordnance blows it up is the loser. (If DMS has an immobilized vehicle on the bridge, and I shoot the vehicle, and then it blows up, and THAT causes the bridge to fall, then the blame falls, like the bridge, upon him. It would "his ordnance" in the vehicle which caused the destruction" © c3k

 

So yes!

 

But he had already moved back his M1. 4 minutes left. Artillery missions are set. Personell over the bridge and general at the aproach.

 

By the way, that Bradley hit by my arty is still alive!

[DMS]

Hm, episode with that Bradley was great and deserves a short movie. Crew thought that my observer is supressed, get out to kill him with M4s but were ambushed by my MG team.

 

Last turn is coming! It seems that Ken generously gives me a draw, as I don't see him. And his Humvee is far away.

[sburke]

Good show, now you get to read his thread and appreciate that you put up a better fight than you knew.

Nice fight DMS, great show and thanks.

[Bil Hardenberger]

Yes, excellent show DMS.  You truly have earned your free copy!

[A Canadian Cat]

He is waiting for his fate with AT-4 near HQ positions.

M1 wounded his assistant on the roof, but he is safe on the 1st floor.

M1s are near. What will they do?

 

Excellent I am ready to do my part - bring on those M1s!

[c3k]

I've just read through this, very quickly. I think it's obvious that DMS fought a very good match. In fact, I'd give him the tactical trophy for this one. Were there any reasonable victory condition, he'd be the winner.

 

Congrats, and it was a pleasure.

 

Ken

[DMS]

I am reading Ken's thread now. A lot of surprises!

 

Fast report about results:

 

 

c3k moved his company commander (IanL, you was company commander for both of us ) to the bridge, Formaly it is a draw, but Ken obiusly crashed my forces and outplayed me.

My observers were distractet by Bradley attack and artillery strike was late.

 

 

My top kill unit (30 kills)

 

 

My most useless unit:

 

[sburke]

nice AAR, great idea and excellent entertainment.

[George MC]

Excellent AAR DMS and c2kS. I've really enjoyed following both sides. Funny, exciting and inspiring in equal measure. Oh and great entertainment! Howz about a rematch?

[A Canadian Cat]

Well done DMS! I managed to survive in both games and end up on the bridge. We also managed to avoid any temporal paradoxes of me killing myself - also good.

 

I am reading Ken's thread now. A lot of surprises!

 

Fast report about results:

 

A word about the points. I forget if I mentioned this in public. I put unit points on the battalion commanders but nothing on the bridge since the victory rules was the battalion HQ had to be on the bridge and CM cannot represent that. So the victory screen reflects the fact that DMS killed ken - wait was that a south park episode?

 

c3k moved his company commander (IanL, you was company commander for both of us ) to the bridge, Formaly it is a draw, but Ken obiusly crashed my forces and outplayed me.

My observers were distractet by Bradley attack and artillery strike was late.

 

I am on the bridge - I declare that I won

 

My top kill unit (30 kills)

 

Wow and his time in the game ended pretty early too. Good work. 

 

My most useless unit:

 

I do not think that is true those planes chewed up quite a few soldiers. I know they did not get any of the M1s like you wanted but they did damage.

[agusto]

Things would maybe have been different had you bought that company of T-72s you mentioned in one of the first posts, but given the force you had at hand, you did well IMO. The APS equipped Abramses are really difficult to take out by anything but 125mm canon fire. Anyways it was an interesting AAR, lots of pictures, cool action, etc. Thanks for taking the time to do this. Hey, you could ask c3k for a rematch and do another AAR, i would certainly read it .

[Heinrich505]

DMS,

  Great job.  Really fun to watch all this unfold.

 

Heinrich505

[DMS]

Thank you all for watching, I am pleased that you liked it!

 

Well done DMS! I managed to survive in both games and end up on the bridge. We also managed to avoid any temporal paradoxes of me killing myself - also good.

 

I do not think that is true those planes chewed up quite a few soldiers. I know they did not get any of the M1s like you wanted but they did damage.

 

Your luck is that I didn't expect company HQ to deal with Abrams!   Too optimistic expectation.

 

Su-25 30mm guns were much more effective than expensive laserguided missiles. They should first attack with gun, then with Kh-25. Now I want to buy DCS flight sim and try it.

 

 

Things would maybe have been different had you bought that company of T-72s you mentioned in one of the first posts, but given the force you had at hand, you did well IMO. The APS equipped Abramses are really difficult to take out by anything but 125mm canon fire. Anyways it was an interesting AAR, lots of pictures, cool action, etc. Thanks for taking the time to do this. Hey, you could ask c3k for a rematch and do another AAR, i would certainly read it .

 

Yeah, but wouldn't that elite Abramss tanks kill them like sitting ducks in meeting engagement? And I could take only a company of them. Though some T-90s and BMPs would be a better choice. BMP spots better and 100mm gun is more serious weapon.

 

In that battle my best units were artillery guns, I think. UAV was very helpfull. This thing changes warfare not less than APS!

Edited February 27, 2015 by DMS

[AttorneyAtWar]

Thank you all for watching, I am pleased that you liked it!

 

 

Your luck is that I didn't expect company HQ to deal with Abrams!   Too optimistic expectation.

 

Su-25 30mm guns were much more effective than expensive laserguided missiles. They should first attack with gun, then with Kh-25. Now I want to buy DCS flight sim and try it.

 

 

 

Yeah, but wouldn't that elite Abramss tanks kill them like sitting ducks in meeting engagement? And I could take only a company of them. Though some T-90s and BMPs would be a better choice. BMP spots better and 100mm gun is more serious weapon.

 

In that battle my best units were artillery guns, I think. UAV was very helpfull. This thing changes warfare not less than APS!

 

You can actually fly the DCS SU-25 for free, just download DCS world and you get it, a training P-51 and the full editor to do what you wish,

[herr_oberst]

Yup, agree with all the rest. Thank you for taking on the challenge of a public AAR with a brand new game.

[Frankster65]

Superb write-up.  Very much enjoyed this.  Thanks for doing it.

[Kraft]

Small correction - the DCS Su-25T is free, the Su-25 is not. 

[DMS]

And some conclusions. (Obvious to expirienced players, but may be intersting to newbies)

 

1) BTR with 30mm gun is sitll BroneTRansporter, i.e. armored carrier. It is not ICV and shouldn't be used like it. Armored track with gun for selfdefence.

It has better operational mobility, i.e. moves on roads faster than tracked vehicles, (30-40 km/h vs 10-20 km/h) but not tactical.

My mistake was that I chose BTR motor infanry. (BTR battalion has ATGM platoon, that's why I chose it)

 

2) Krizantema spots bad and radar doesn't help it to fire through smoke. (It lased Ken's M1, I read it in his thread, but I didn't see contact icon) Shouldn't be used closer than 2000 metres to the enemy. And it needs infantry support, who will report about incoming enemy. And hull down, only hull down!

 

3) ATGMs are useless when target quickly moves from cover to cover, they can't replace good old tanks. And they are useless against APS. May be if I would choose a platoon of T-72s they could inflict more damage, setting ambushes and making fire sacks.

 

4) Calling artillery strike using UAV is inaccurate.

[A Canadian Cat]

And some conclusions. (Obvious to expirienced players, but may be intersting to newbies)

 

1) BTR with 30mm gun is sitll BroneTRansporter, i.e. armored carrier. It is not ICV and shouldn't be used like it. Armored track with gun for selfdefence.

It has better operational mobility, i.e. moves on roads faster than tracked vehicles, (30-40 km/h vs 10-20 km/h) but not tactical.

My mistake was that I chose BTR motor infanry. (BTR battalion has ATGM platoon, that's why I chose it)

 

Indeed.  I suppose if you had driven like a mad man to get all your infantry into town their increased speed would be useful but you are right they really did not stand up against the Bradleys.

 

2) Krizantema spots bad and radar doesn't help it to fire through smoke. (It lased Ken's M1, I read it in his thread, but I didn't see contact icon) Shouldn't be used closer than 2000 metres to the enemy. And it needs infantry support, who will report about incoming enemy. And hull down, only hull down!

 

Yeah, I have had good success with them when they a) have cover and are a long way off.  They fire two missiles at a time so I have seen them even beat APS (rarely its true). 

 

3) ATGMs are useless when target quickly moves from cover to cover, they can't replace good old tanks. And they are useless against APS. May be if I would choose a platoon of T-72s they could inflict more damage, setting ambushes and making fire sacks.

 

Yeah that was quite a demo of APS kicking a** that's for sure.  Wow.

 

4) Calling artillery strike using UAV is inaccurate.

Now that one I have not experienced.  What artillery was wonky for you?

[DMS]

 

Indeed.  I suppose if you had driven like a mad man to get all your infantry into town their increased speed would be useful but you are right they really did not stand up against the Bradleys.

 

 

Yeah, I have had good success with them when they a) have cover and are a long way off.  They fire two missiles at a time so I have seen them even beat APS (rarely its true). 

 

 

Yeah that was quite a demo of APS kicking a** that's for sure.  Wow.

 

Now that one I have not experienced.  What artillery was wonky for you?

 

I was afraid that c3k will place Abrams at that hill and will get LOS to the road. In that case all my BTRs would burn soon.

But he didn't! So it was my mistake.

 

People from Russian LJ WT comunity where I posted AAR say that Kh-25 should destroy APS by near explosion. 80 kg warhead. But missile is destroyed by APS, isn't it? Whould it explode 100%?

By the way, may be somebody speaks Russian? That AAR is there: http://war-tundra.livejournal.com/2851122.html#t155621682

 

Arty was called by me, (Battlegroup HQ) with the help of UAV operator. And it missed target. (120mm mortars). In the other case it fired accurately.

Edited March 2, 2015 by DMS

[A Canadian Cat]

I was afraid that c3k will place Abrams at that hill and will get LOS to the road. In that case all my BTRs would burn soon.

But he didn't! So it was my mistake.

Well, I am not sure I would call it a mistake because if he had put an M1 in overwatch there and you did what I suggested things would have gone very badly indeed.

 

Arty was called by me, (Battlegroup HQ) with the help of UAV operator. And it missed target. (120mm mortars). In the other case it fired accurately.

Maybe it was just you But seriously I have no idea what went off - perhaps some spotting rounds landed out side the UAVs observation area. I have not seen a particular problem with UAV called artillery before but I'll keep my eyes open going forward.