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Trooper117

No British forces?

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As a Brit myself I would advise against writing us off too soon. Yes, the public is fed up with war right now. After 13 years spent propping up a corrupt government and police force in Afghanistan, and the shambles that Iraq is now in, the public is rightly skeptical about any more "foreign adventures". On top of that there's the deficit and subsequent austerity measures, including substantial cuts to the military.

Despite all this, we still have one of the most powerful armed forces in the world, and strong links to the US. Personally I doubt even the US would actually enter into a shooting war with Russia over Ukraine, but if that line was crossed, you can bet the Brits would be under immense pressure to join the conflict. It would be difficult for any British government to stay out, even with public opposition.

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Weak, no one will help. Ukraine had guarantees about their borders from USA, GB and Russia, and how it ended?

It didn't. Ukraine is still a free country. And a Russian guarantee isn't worth the paper it's written on.

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I'm going to go out on a limb and assume that all the blue forces from Shockforces will make a return, with British, German, USMC, Canadian, and the Netherlands forces being mostly already modeled in the previous game. Seems like an easy and obvious add-on.

My wallet is ready.

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I'm going to go out on a limb and assume that all the blue forces from Shockforces will make a return, with British, German, USMC, Canadian, and the Netherlands forces being mostly already modeled in the previous game. Seems like an easy and obvious add-on.

My wallet is ready.

That's a good assumption, but I'm guessing one could do all the Polish Vehicles pulling from that list and what is already in the game. Poland would be the first candidate for an involved NATO country, IMO.

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That's a good assumption, but I'm guessing one could do all the Polish Vehicles pulling from that list and what is already in the game. Poland would be the first candidate for an involved NATO country, IMO.

Poland would be an awesome addition. I just don't think it is a slam-dunk like the previous entries, just because the previous entries really just require a texture change.

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I just don't think it is a slam-dunk like the previous entries, just because the previous entries really just require a texture change.

While I haven't taken a really close look at the the other NATO countries yet, we found that porting USA stuff from CMSF was actually a lot more work than just copying over data and changing the textures. Just about every weapon and vehicle had evolved over the years, with subsystem additions, parts being swapped out, new ammunition, etc etc... Then there are things associated with those weapons and animations that have improved since CMSF, like more detailed animations and dynamic soldier gear. Then add in entirely new classes of equipment since CMSF, like on-map mortars and AA weapons.

Still, it's definitely easier than making things completely from scratch, but we found that it's still a non-trivial amount of work. I imagine that other NATO countries will be a bit easier to copy over than the US however, since I'd bet that US equipment has evolved more over the last decade than many other nations (spending such a gigantic chunk of your GDP on the military tends to do that).

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I imagine that other NATO countries will be a bit easier to copy over than the US however, since I'd bet that US equipment has evolved more over the last decade than many other nations (spending such a gigantic chunk of your GDP on the military tends to do that).

Especially with the defence budget cuts, such as the Dutch selling all of their tanks etc.

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I definitely support the motion for a Polish add-on. They have a unique mix of equipment and with them being a NATO country bordering Ukraine, their involvement in a hypothetical conflict is certainly plausible.

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It didn't. Ukraine is still a free country. And a Russian guarantee isn't worth the paper it's written on.

Poland is a NATO country. If it is invaded NATO is obligated to act. Ukraine was not. On the other hand if polish forces move to support Ukraine NATO is not obligated to act.

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I'm going to go out on a limb and assume that all the blue forces from Shockforces will make a return, with British, German, USMC, Canadian, and the Netherlands forces...

While I am not about to read the USMC out, it's a little difficult for me to envision a role for them to play in Ukraine aside from just providing more cannon fodder. While they are usually good at whatever job they are handed, they are specifically trained to make ship-to-shore assault landings. Such training is costly and should not be squandered on performing tasks more traditionally allotted to the Army. Having said that though, if the balloon goes up almost anything could happen.

Michael

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I think there are some Marines here who would probably redefine for you what ship to shore means now. I would definitely not count them out as a force that could be deployed to upset the apple cart of Russian offensive plans.

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Still, it's definitely easier than making things completely from scratch, but we found that it's still a non-trivial amount of work.

Given that sentiment is there any word on how CMSF porting will one day be handled? I realise it's a long way down the road for BF.

Could there theoretically be one big modern era title with lots of modules? Given the modern era players will be more than likely be focusing on creating fictional conflicts (hopefully!) rather than recreating historical encounters as we tend to do in WW2 -having less restraints and a greater degree of versatility in force composition and geography would be great. I mean couldn't this fictional Black Sea conflict spread into other regions for the sake of gameplay? Russians in the Middle East?

I understand that BF needs to pay bills and eat, but for my mind it wouldn't bother me if the price of a module was a little higher if the modern era releases were together in one family. It would give us a hell of a wargaming sandbox to play with in the long term.

Sorry off topic... yeah British forces would be a great addition. :)

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Hi,

Yes... in Britain things are up in the air in a way that has not been the case for forty years.

Britain will for sure go to war again. The BBC was massively over spinning to egg up the program.

The “swing...” voters who count, are chased by the politicians is changing. For those who don know, if not British why should you ;), the middle ground swing voters in the UK have been for forty odd years, by name less by but inclination whatever the name, been Lib Dems.

In Britain they are in many ways more “left wing..”, for good or ill, than most Labour voters. More ”PC..”.

This has determined a lot of British policies. As swing voters do in all western countries.

In the UK now “the swing voters to chase...” is changing to become a party called UKIP. They by contrast are the least “PC...” party in the UK. Less PC than the Conservatives..

If you are still with me.. ; ).. this means very big changes may result.

I couldn’t like political discussions on CM forums, don’t join in, I say the above to give the background. Make your own mind up if you think it good or bad. Or as to how far it may go. But this is the trend after Labour found its vote too is vulnerable to UKIP.

In summary... British politics, for good or ill, is changing very fast from being driven by having to accommodate Lim Dem swing voters with their often very Europhile and PC views to having to accommodate UKIP type sympathise with their very anti-EU, anti- PC views.

All the best,

Kip.

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Given that sentiment is there any word on how CMSF porting will one day be handled? I realise it's a long way down the road for BF.

Could there theoretically be one big modern era title with lots of modules? Given the modern era players will be more than likely be focusing on creating fictional conflicts (hopefully!) rather than recreating historical encounters as we tend to do in WW2 -having less restraints and a greater degree of versatility in force composition and geography would be great. I mean couldn't this fictional Black Sea conflict spread into other regions for the sake of gameplay? Russians in the Middle East?

I understand that BF needs to pay bills and eat, but for my mind it wouldn't bother me if the price of a module was a little higher if the modern era releases were together in one family. It would give us a hell of a wargaming sandbox to play with in the long term.

Sorry off topic... yeah British forces would be a great addition. :)

Not sure I agree with all of this. One point made by many about CMSF was 'I wasn't engaged with the fictional Syria setting'

As to the tendency to create historical WW2 scenarios in the CM family - my observation from CMRT is that many of the Community released scenarios are not historical. This is not a pop at the designers at all - those that I have had the privilege to try out have been great fun to play.

As a modern era scenario designer - all of my CMSF scenarios have been closely based on real actions.

But ... British Forces would be a great addition.

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While I am not about to read the USMC out, it's a little difficult for me to envision a role for them to play in Ukraine aside from just providing more cannon fodder.

The Crimea. Tiny strip of land connecting it to the main part of Ukraine. Lots of lovely beaches.

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The Crimea. Tiny strip of land connecting it to the main part of Ukraine. Lots of lovely beaches.

That was the first thing I thought of when I wrote about not reading them out. There is the Baltic too. Maybe not as many beaches, but the Marines have been into vertical envelopment for six decades now.

Michael

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The Crimea. Tiny strip of land connecting it to the main part of Ukraine. Lots of lovely beaches.

Yes they could try a small harbour called Balaclava, which is within excellent striking distance of Sevastopol. Hang on, hasn't this been done before?:)

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Not sure I agree with all of this. One point made by many about CMSF was 'I wasn't engaged with the fictional Syria setting'

As to the tendency to create historical WW2 scenarios in the CM family - my observation from CMRT is that many of the Community released scenarios are not historical. This is not a pop at the designers at all - those that I have had the privilege to try out have been great fun to play.

As a modern era scenario designer - all of my CMSF scenarios have been closely based on real actions.

But ... British Forces would be a great addition.

+1 and what made CMSF so good according to me was the posibilty to recreate historical actions in Afghanistan, Iraq etc. Designers with deep knowledge about this made some truly great scenarios.

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