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Combat footage from Ukraine

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The conversations are amazing re their mundaneness.

Interesting to see the glacial pace of action and attacks. Make me think most CM2 scenarios are way too rushed.

Yeah I'd agree. Between too much Hollywood and the constraints of being a game we definitely suffer from time compression.

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You have to realize that these filmed acions are relatively low intensity, long distance encounters.

There are no direct assaults, ambushes or any major firefights between the combatants.

As you said it is mostly strolling down village streets, conversaions between the fighters, and an occasional sound of gunfire or mortar fire. This is not real combat, not even as depicted in CM. Like I said earlier, it looks more like urban turf battles between street gangs.

The only really dangerous stuff going on from what I can tell from news reports are the artillery duels, which fall into suburban neighborhoods and Ukrainian industrial infrastructure. Rebel forces getting most heavy stuff from the Russians, who seem to be quite satisfied to keep this level of fighting active. I think any serious battles with high body counts would tend to affect public opinion.

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Go pro footage

News clip, notice the slat armor BRDM-2 at the end

Ural mounted ZU-23 firing on Donetsk airport

News clip from the fighting at the airport

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=35c_1412178798

Another Grad launch at night

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqSmL87RwHQ

Use of drone for mortar attack

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=b0c_1412147779

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Ural mounted ZU-23 firing on Donetsk airport

Look at the huge muzzle flash, something must be wrong with that ZSU-23. I have seen lots of videos of ZSU-23s beeing fired and usually the muzzle flash is barley visable during daylight.

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Yeah I'd agree. Between too much Hollywood and the constraints of being a game we definitely suffer from time compression.

Respectfully, what you are doing is just as silly as "trust me, I've seen this on TV".

"Trust me, I've seen this on the internet and now I'm a specialist on war."

The truth is that you do NOT get the entire picture by watching the available combat footage. That combat footage is only the tip of the iceberg. You (and I) have no idea what is in reality going on during that conflict because we only see small fragments of it.

You have to realize that these filmed acions are relatively low intensity, long distance encounters.

There are no direct assaults, ambushes or any major firefights between the combatants.

As you said it is mostly strolling down village streets, conversaions between the fighters, and an occasional sound of gunfire or mortar fire. This is not real combat, not even as depicted in CM. Like I said earlier, it looks more like urban turf battles between street gangs.

The only really dangerous stuff going on from what I can tell from news reports are the artillery duels, which fall into suburban neighborhoods and Ukrainian industrial infrastructure. Rebel forces getting most heavy stuff from the Russians, who seem to be quite satisfied to keep this level of fighting active. I think any serious battles with high body counts would tend to affect public opinion.

To give you some examples off the top of my head. There have been reports of ambushes and direct assaults in the past. In one particular case, what looked like a company sized mechanized/motorized unit (from the Azov battalion, if I remember correctly) got ambushed and wiped out. There have also been stories about Ukrainian dead troops being moved by many truck loads after a battle a few months ago. We also know how a significant part of the Ukrainian army that was positioned near the Russian border (doing that flanking maneuver) got virtually wiped out. I think it's safe to say that they were probably engaged in a few major firefights. So high intensity fighting does happen, we just don't get to see it.

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To give you some examples off the top of my head. There have been reports of ambushes and direct assaults in the past. In one particular case, what looked like a company sized mechanized/motorized unit (from the Azov battalion, if I remember correctly) got ambushed and wiped out. There have also been stories about Ukrainian dead troops being moved by many truck loads after a battle a few months ago. We also know how a significant part of the Ukrainian army that was positioned near the Russian border (doing that flanking maneuver) got virtually wiped out. I think it's safe to say that they were probably engaged in a few major firefights. So high intensity fighting does happen, we just don't get to see it.

I'm sure you are right, the death toll since this all began is nearly 3000. I am basing my observations here solely on the video clips that have been posted in this thread.

I'm thinking that the guy with the cell phone camera taking these particular clips is content to stay as far away as possible from the real dangerous action.

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Respectfully, what you are doing is just as silly as "trust me, I've seen this on TV".

"Trust me, I've seen this on the internet and now I'm a specialist on war."

The truth is that you do NOT get the entire picture by watching the available combat footage. That combat footage is only the tip of the iceberg. You (and I) have no idea what is in reality going on during that conflict because we only see small fragments of it.

Heh I am not only not a specialist on war, I am not even a specialist on CM. However I'd still hold that CM does suffer from time compression. The simple fact that you are the commander at all levels of the c2 chain and have no real terrain fow means we do commit to action and change our tactical position and orders instantaneously. A real environment would require a lot more interaction within the chain of command and commensurately slower pace.

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More footage from the airport with our friend "Givi" mostly on the phone still leading his men.....

This has good footage of him and his men laying the T-12 at gun on the airport

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kx3HfmiSb6U

News clip with a short interview with Givi

http://edition.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/world/2014/09/02/pkg-magnay-ukraine-ilovaisk-captured.cnn.html

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Heh I am not only not a specialist on war, I am not even a specialist on CM. However I'd still hold that CM does suffer from time compression. The simple fact that you are the commander at all levels of the c2 chain and have no real terrain fow means we do commit to action and change our tactical position and orders instantaneously. A real environment would require a lot more interaction within the chain of command and commensurately slower pace.

It depends. For certain scenarios the pacing is just right. For other scenarios you might be right and things move too fast. But I'm not sure you can simulate C2 100% realistically without taking away some control from the player (letting other players or AI take control on some level).

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It depends. For certain scenarios the pacing is just right. For other scenarios you might be right and things move too fast. But I'm not sure you can simulate C2 100% realistically without taking away some control from the player (letting other players or AI take control on some level).

Absolutely agree. You still have to be able to play it. I sometimes mess around with rules forcing my teams to spend time transmitting orders, sending runners etc. :D

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Wow, the footage with the translation is truely excellent. The ukrainian seperatists seem to be bloody well equipped and organised when compared to the insurgents in syria. I wonder why the ukrainians allow them to move around with their tanks that freely.

This guy wont live long. No helmet, no flak vest, standing out in the open and not caring about artillery falling so close that the fragments land next to his feet.

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This guy wont live long. No helmet, no flak vest, standing out in the open and not caring about artillery falling so close that the fragments land next to his feet.

Ya i thought the same when i saw that it immediately reminded me of this

http://www.chechensinsyria.com/?p=19680

You can laugh at the of the queen of the battlefield only for so long till she slap bitch slaps you something fierce. But hey he did look badass in front of the camera had his own

moment

Here is another interview with Him on the situation at the airport

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Btw, His name is Givi and he's a bataillon commander. Has been in constant combat with the "motorola" unit since may without a scratch. He's giving a press conference and he's not in combat. The ukrainians let the tanks move freely around because their air power has been severely diminished by MANPADS (lost 45 aircrafts since april), their pilots are badly trained. Their artillery is only good for hitting civilian areas. The Ukrainian army is really looking like a bunch of bloody incompetent amateurs and posers in this war except for their airmobile units and paratroopers.

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Ya some real balls to wall heroes there.....

The best thing they could do to physically attack Poland is probably launch somke terrorist attacks, car bombs etc, making their already very questionable legitimacy as independent state even more questionable.

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Ya some real balls to wall heroes there.....

Well, if that isn't the pot calling the kettle black.

He complains about Poland supplying weapons to Ukraine. Interesting to ignore the fact that the very equipment the separatists are armed with comes from Russia. Because all that high grade armor and air defence systems suddenly running around the Donetsk area was bought with Donetsk republic credit cards at the local Donetsk hardware store. Or so the separatists would have us believe. Riiiigghhtt. :rolleyes:

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