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Status update on "Black Sea"

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This is about a game? Oh damn, I got my Conplan 2015 forum mixed up with my Battlefront.com one again. Sorry Guys!! :)

Just playing a little what if Chris. Not trying to one up you guys or second guess. Its an interesting tactical problem, is all. Its like catnip.

Oh, I know. :) Just getting ahead of it before wargamers do their specialty and lose sight of the forest for the trees. ;)

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Chris ND "..worth remembering the big picture: this is a tactical game, and what happens before the player gets his forces to play with on the battlefield is essentially a minor detail.

The operational/strategic backstory must fit the needs of the tactical CM battleground... not the other way around. We've got a game to make here, not a novel to write."

GH42"..Just playing a little what if Chris. Not trying to one up you guys or second guess. Its an interesting tactical problem, is all. Its like catnip."

The CM fun (relaxation from work) factor is most important to me. I learn a bunch from the guys who have real world experience. Operational/strategic/tactical research is something I will seldom do. When CMXX is a "war-game" to play (for fun) with authentic realism and gets explained to me in valuable forum threads ... then CM games are a win-win+ for me.

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Most of the heavy armor would be provided by the Germans, British, French (who would join in the fight), Italians, and the mix of armor from other European nations.

Steve

Did anybody notice the hidden bone? There will be French forces. :)

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Holy crow Gunhappy42! I just noticed your sig line. Nice to see you back! You want your old account back? Some people around here would beat up their grandmothers for a year 2000 join date :) Would be more than happy to rewire some stuff if you want to relive your old glory days.

Steve

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Looks interesting though I would still have liked a winter war option. A Fifth Battle of Kharkov fouught between Russia and Ukraine fought on the same ground as the 1943 Third Battle of Kharkov at the same time of year.

For expansions I would like Polish, Germans, French, British, Hungarian, Roumania, Belorussian. Possibly Baltic States.

Heh, what's to say we won't see someone do that? BF's story is just a backdrop to give us the kit. What we do with it is up to us. I could see someone doing another battle for Kharkhov featuring the Bundeswehr. Hell maybe BF will do it for one of the modules.

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I think that even though Russia wont be technically getting new "allied" forces through modules, different Russian branches could be added. MVD when uncons are added for example. Or Russian VDV as a branch if only heavy MSV units are included in the initial game.

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Thank you for the tantalizing look at what's coming up Steve. I've got a long term interest in Ukraine, Russian, Soviet history and although it's sad about current events, as your own plans for a game show, they're not a complete surprise to observers.

It's completely understandable you're worried about cheap shots being levelled at BF (what's the military equivalent of ambulance chasing?) but given we knew about the upcoming game long before these events, as you say it's easy to prove you've simply been good at identifying a realistic scenario for a modern conflict. While most or all of us don't rejoice at recent events - I've actually been pretty upset by it all - it reflects well on BF's understanding of conflicts and what drives them, in other words you don't just go around making s41t up.

With the imminent release of CMRT and with Black Sea hot on its heels, I tell you I'm in wargamer heaven. However and I don't say this just to be PC, I sincerely hope the closest I come to seeing the type of conflict we're discussing remains confined to my screen when I purchase the game.

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We have concluded that Belarus would sit it out, though would give covert support to Russia. In fact, part of our storyline's details is they allow Russian special forces to infiltrate into northern Ukraine (west of Kiev) through Belarus' territory.

NATO would not likely want to start a war with Belarus as it would have it's hands full in the Ukraine. Belarus, on the other hand, wouldn't want to risk Poland and the Baltic states taking their own form of action for which Russia would be of no help.

No, as I see it Belarus would likely want to stay out of a direct and overt role in the conflict.

Steve

A fair enough geopolitical point. i think Poland amnd the Baltic States as NATO members are likely to be involved anyway for that reason. Russia cold retaliate by taking a swipe at the Baltc States which would likely have at least some NATO forces deployed there anyway for defensive purposes. Not that the Russians are likely to care about that much oce open warfare has started. And the poor Beolorussians are sittig in the middle of all of that - quivering and hoping not to be invaded themselves by either side! :D

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Heh, what's to say we won't see someone do that? BF's story is just a backdrop to give us the kit. What we do with it is up to us. I could see someone doing another battle for Kharkhov featuring the Bundeswehr. Hell maybe BF will do it for one of the modules.

I rather fancy gaming some modern winter battles in this theatre having seen some of the footage of the Russian military manouvers on their side of the border. A little less snow than I expected to see mind you but still some patches that were clearly visible.

In awar like this I can see Kharkov being the scene of at least twomajor battles, first as Ukraine defends against the initial invasion and then in the NATO counter offensive. And ceraily the Bundeswehr could well d feature,possibly even in both!

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Thank you for the tantalizing look at what's coming up Steve. I've got a long term interest in Ukraine, Russian, Soviet history and although it's sad about current events, as your own plans for a game show, they're not a complete surprise to observers.

It's completely understandable you're worried about cheap shots being levelled at BF (what's the military equivalent of ambulance chasing?) but given we knew about the upcoming game long before these events, as you say it's easy to prove you've simply been good at identifying a realistic scenario for a modern conflict. While most or all of us don't rejoice at recent events - I've actually been pretty upset by it all - it reflects well on BF's understanding of conflicts and what drives them, in other words you don't just go around making s41t up.

With the imminent release of CMRT and with Black Sea hot on its heels, I tell you I'm in wargamer heaven. However and I don't say this just to be PC, I sincerely hope the closest I come to seeing the type of conflict we're discussing remains confined to my screen when I purchase the game.

Hopefully, by the late spring publication date everythig will have calmed down anyway And, if bnot I am sure obody would object to a delay.

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You're already spoiling (or perhaps tormenting us) with all the back story info Steve but can we get any hints on what new features to expect in 3.0?

CM:Black Sea will have the same features as CM:RT. They are both version 3.0 of the game engine.

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"CM:Black Sea will have the same features as CM:RT. They are both version 3.0 of the game engine."

Credit Cards ready ;)

I need to get my Hackintosh parts ordered asap. Apple has yet to get their new Nvidia graphics drivers delivered after 10.9.2 so being a CM Addict ;) I may need the other "evil OS" system to calm my nerves :D

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CM:Black Sea will have the same features as CM:RT. They are both version 3.0 of the game engine.

And then some, most likely.

I'm currently on the Beta Tester team for CMRT but not for CMBS, which means I can speculate all I want about CMBS because I don't know any NPI about it and therefore can't violate my NDA. ;)

Anyway, I think it's a pretty safe guess that at least a few new features not present in CMRT will make it into the engine by the time CMBS is released. My SWAG is that they'll probably be features particularly important to Modern Warfare, but I have no information as to specifics other than my own idle musings. :D

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My post above was based on the following:

Glad you like what you've seen so far!

1. Not sure if we'll allow Ammo Dumps to be damaged/destroyed. There are "gamey" ramifications that could come from that. In real life you didn't have stockpiles of ammo blowing up all the time at the tactical level. So we're thinking there's some good reasons for that.

2. Yes, the new Eastern Front game will start out v3.0 as will Black Sea. They're going to come out fairly close together, but we had to pick one to focus on and of the two Black Sea could use the longer time in the oven because it's the first time we've been back to Modern for several years while WW2 is all we've been doing since.

3. More info about release timing will be out in January. But I can say you won't have to wait too much longer. And I'm talking real world definition of that term, not the one that is in relation to traditional Battlefront concepts of time :D

4. We've got no plans to extend battles beyond 4 hours. I don't know if we'll extend Quick Battles beyond 2 hours, but I suppose I can kick that one over to Charles and see what he says.

Steve

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This is totally my interpretation, but I would parse the above to mean that CMBS will be released as version 3.x of the engine, likely with some minor, incremental improvements over the CMRT 3.0 release (3.1?). BFC usually doesn't let a major game or module release go by without adding *something* to the game engine, even if it's just a few minor improvements.

This is in contrast to if they announced CMBS as a full-out 4.0 upgrade to the game engine, which would imply more, and more significant new features.

So I think there is reason to hope for at least a couple of minor engine improvements. I wouldn't expect anything big, though.

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"Black Sea" will be engine version 3.0, the same as Red Thunder. However, there will be some extra features unique to the modern setting. More info at a later time.

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Steve,

Sure, I'll take my old handle back. Been away for awhile. There being a war and all. Good to be back talking hypotheticals, history, etc.

I merged your GunHappy42 posts in with your old ScoutPL account. Pretty cool... I didn't even know that could be done! Learn something new every day :D

You probably want to edit your profile. I sent you a password reminder.

Welcome back!

Steve

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Welcome home ScoutPL.

"Black Sea" will be engine version 3.0, the same as Red Thunder. However, there will be some extra features unique to the modern setting. More info at a later time." Now is a later time ChrisND ;)

Need some fun fix facts as I am finalizing my "Evil OS" Dual Boot Hackintosh parts list for next week.

YD.."..CMBS will be released as version 3.x of the engine, likely with some minor, incremental improvements over the CMRT 3.0 release (3.1?).... "

Yeah next week so I can do my 1st build and get it right before I am overwhelmed by the Russian Hordes ;)

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I dont suppose we can forego the hundred million threads and posts about east vs west and who has the best tactics, tanks, rifle, sexiest pixel butt, etc when CMRT comes out, can we? I cringe when I think about how much we went round and round when CMBB came out.

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