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PhilM

QB maps: Allied attack only?

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New to playing PBEM, I am trying to set up a game with an Axis (counter)attack against an Allied defence of a village. I chose a map at random (Asslt Large Village (water) QB-259.btt), but find when getting to the setup phase (and later checking in the editor) that the map's setup zones seem not to be for attacker/defender, but for Allies/Axis: and given the zones' location and extent, they can realistically be used only for an Allied attack v an Axis defence and not the other way around.

Of course in the CMBN timeframe the usual position is the Axis trying to hold ground and the Allies trying to kick them off it, but localised counter attacks must make vice versa a fairly frequent occurrence.

Was I just unlucky in my map choice (or do something silly in the game setup screen), or are maps often (always?) set up to be used in a force-specific, rather than a stance-specific, way? Or is there something I should have seen, but didn't, in the map's description to tell me this one could be used only this way round?

I have never used the editor: now might be a good time to learn! I presume I can edit the map to swap the zones around and share that edited map with my opponent so we can have that map with an Axis attack? Or does a "mirror" version of it, set up the other way round, already exist perhaps?

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Due to how QB AI orders are set up and how points totals are counted *one side* needed to always be the attacker and *the other side* always the defender on an attack/assault map. For map construction purposes allied side = attacker. Its a hard and fast rule. While playing QBs you can of course make either (or any) force the attacker.

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As far as I know the infamous "reversed setup zone bug" is still a problem. Not always but often enough. And it has to do with the Allies beeing the attacker in QB maps. But there is a solution. Open the according map in the editor, change mission parameters to the ones you want (Axis attacker, Allies Defender) and "repaint" the setup zones. Paint the Allies zone as Axis and vice versa. Then save the map with a different name (for example 003Attck_AxisAttacker) and voila with that map there are no problems anymore.

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Due to how QB AI orders are set up and how points totals are counted *one side* needed to always be the attacker and *the other side* always the defender on an attack/assault map. For map construction purposes allied side = attacker. Its a hard and fast rule. While playing QBs you can of course make either (or any) force the attacker.

Thanks for this. If I understand you correctly, still leaves me thinking (my bold of your last sentence above): but not, on this map, in practice? Not without also switching the setup zones, because the Axis forces were "attacking" from a (defender's) set up zone in which they already occupied all the VP locations, whilst the Allies were "defending" from an (attacker's) set up zone in one corner of the map with no access to the VP locations they were to defend?

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As far as I know the infamous "reversed setup zone bug" is still a problem. Not always but often enough. And it has to do with the Allies beeing the attacker in QB maps. But there is a solution. Open the according map in the editor, change mission parameters to the ones you want (Axis attacker, Allies Defender) and "repaint" the setup zones. Paint the Allies zone as Axis and vice versa. Then save the map with a different name (for example 003Attck_AxisAttacker) and voila with that map there are no problems anymore.

By calling it a "bug", do you mean that the QB should have coped with me switching the sides and automatically switched the setup zones to match? Or does one always have to edit the QB map, if it's an assault / attack map, to play Axis as attackers, because all those maps have been set up (as MikeyD said above) with Axis as defenders?

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By calling it a "bug", do you mean that the QB should have coped with me switching the sides and automatically switched the setup zones to match?

Yes, that is how it is supposed to work.

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No one is quite sure what triggers the inability to make the switch. I have faced this a few times and as recently as a few days ago. I have no idea what causes it to happen. I hope they can track it down and fix it at some point.

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Not all the QB maps are set to Allied Probe/Attack/Assault.

There is also a fair amount of Axis Probe/Attack/Assault maps in the mix.

You could use the CMx2 ScAnCaDe tool (see my signature) to make a listing of all QB maps with their respective parameters and then select an Axis Attack map manually.

This should help with avoiding the "reverse setup zones" bug.

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What I wrote above is just kind of a hotfix. If you encounter this odd behaviour just do as I wrote above and you are able to play the map. But what triggers this behaviour I don`t know. Most of the times it works although the parameters are not altered. But in the case the "bug" occurs, then you know now how to get around it.

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