Scenario: KG Himmelfahrt

[Erwin]

Thanks mate...

[Mord]

I can only presume that we haven't heard anything more from Vanir and Mord as they are deeply involved in playing "KG Himmelfahrt" in order to help Pandur out with their feedback lol.

LOL OK, I'll tell you what, you make 40 something mods, and say, 5 scenarios (which is a decent average for most designers) and I'll stop making mods altogether and spend the rest of my life struggling, and sweating, and working really, really hard to play the game so I can give some one feedback.

That sounds like a fair trade.

Other than that, my post wasn't about feedback. Feedback is good...and sometimes yours is good...'cept about 70% of the time your "feedback" sounds like outright complaining....that's what I was talking about. Anyway, it is what it is. Everybody's happy, so carry on...sounds like Pandur is getting what he needs.

Mord.

[Erwin]

Well unless your idea of feedback is "yes, you're brilliant, great job, you are wonderful, don't change a thing" then yes, useful feedback has to be critical in some way BUT should also be accompanied with practical suggestions for why and how the issue can be improved. In this instance feedback was requested. You interjected yourself into the thread when it appears that you hadn't bothered to even play the scenario, and you didn't add anything positive or helpful to the discussion.

Seriously, Mord... I get private messages from people here who are scared to post messages publicly cos of VSB's (Venom Spewing Bullies) who they fear will dump on them.

The thing with VSB's is that they make themselves feel better when they can humiliate other posters or make them feel like crap. I believe we all have a duty to monitor VSB type activity and call these nasty jerks on their behavior whenever it happens. Hopefully, they will start behaving a bit more maturely, or go away and bother someone else.

You, me and all the other frequent posters here have to be a bit more tolerant of each other and focus more on eliminating posts that offer nothing but bullying insults like this one:

"If you didn't bitch or have a passive aggressive comment for just about everything anybody here ever does, designers might be apt to consider your viewpoint more openly. You are one of the most demanding dudes on this board. Everything with you is "work"...CMX2 is work...the scenario is work...loading mods is work. Thing is, you aren't doing any work...you are benefiting from the WORK other people do...and apparently nobody can do any of it well enough to satisfy you. It gets f*****' old."

[Mord]

Yes, we know, you are a victim...

Reread what you quoted. It's not a bullying insult. It's completely accurate. There's more truth there than you care to admit. Just think of it as constructive criticism. Your "feedback" at times becomes anal retentive, nit picking...it's not feed back at all but entitled complaining and expectation. You seem to be the only one that doesn't see it.

Here's a small example of a typical passive aggressive, Erwin reply...

Thanks for the mod...too bad you didn't do one for CMA, CMSF, CMFI...

Thanks for the mod too bad it wasn't packaged right.

Thanks for the mod but it's a lot like work loading it...

Thanks for the mod but one button irritates me, can you change it?

Etc. etc. etc. ad nauseum...I've gotten lots of PMs and emails as well, you have quite the reputation among modders for being anal and impossible to please...so, there you go...it's not just me. They however, are more diplomatic than I am.

I have absolutely no problem with criticism as you keep inferring...One of the worst critiques I've ever gotten is still up in the Repos and I completely agree with it. An excellent critique had me remake my first US voice mod for CMSF. Another, one of yours, lead me to redesign my portraits for CMBN. So...you're wrong. But there's a difference between critique and demands, passive aggressive or otherwise...one day you may understand it.

I've told you before, I don't dislike you, at times I think you make some good points...but your obsessiveness makes me want to strangle you.

Mord.

[LongLeftFlank]

I will take the Ring to Mordor!

[sburke]

I will take the Ring to Mordor!

rotflmao excellent, most excellent sir

but umm you're on your own, Rosie ain't waitin for me this time

[sburke]

Back to the actual subject. I don't want to provide any spoilers, but so far Pandur I am getting a fairly bloody nose. It is still early, but those damned Amis are making me pay dearly for not reconning better and taking more time to plan my assaults. Very nice. Not having any issues running it yet and the defense is giving me some headaches.

[Erwin]

I am not a victim, Mord, just one of the very few people here who give any feedback or thanks at all, and am not initimidated by the rudeness and unpleasantness of VSB's who seem to enjoy dumping on posters when they offer an opinion that differs from theirs.

You interprete everything in the most negative way, even when someone is trying to be helpful. I don't know where your thin skin, bitterness and mean replies originate from. But, in my experience you must have some awful personal, professional issues or problems at home that motivate the mean and intolerant posts that you make simply to make yourself feel like a "big man".

I enjoy playing the game. Nobody needs to provide feedback, say thanks, or acknowledge the work of others. Maybe you should consider having your own forum where you can say what you want and nobody else says anything. Then you would not be irritated so much.

[Mord]

LOL. Thanks for the psychoanalysis, PAM...it was eye opening and riveting. Who knew the persecution you've endured at my hands? I can't believe you've managed to cope. You are very strong!

I don't interpret, I just read what you write.

Maybe you should consider your own PAM forum where bullied, downtrodden victims can meet and discuss the intricacies and evils of someone pointing out their b***s**t on the internet? It may kick your fledgling psychiatry practice into full gear...a whole new world of demanding, entitlement awaits!

"My name is Erwin and I am NOT a victim...I just play one on the world wide web."

Mord.

PAM: Passive Aggressive Martyr

[Erwin]

So, you find the following text offensive:

“Thanks for the mod...too bad you didn't do one for CMA, CMSF, CMFI...

Thanks for the mod too bad it wasn't packaged right.

Thanks for the mod but it's a lot like work loading it...

Thanks for the mod but one button irritates me, can you change it?”

After a search I can't actually find those comments as written. You appear to have paraphrased in order to better justify your childish response:

"If you didn't bitch or have a passive aggressive comment for just about everything anybody here ever does, designers might be apt to consider your viewpoint more openly.

You are one of the most demanding dudes on this board. Everything with you is "work"...CMX2 is work...the scenario is work...loading mods is work. Thing is, you aren't

doing any work...you are benefiting from the WORK other people do...and apparently nobody can do any of it well enough to satisfy you. It gets f*****' old."

You really don’t see the qualitative difference? A lot of people are reading what you write, and I feel embarrassed for you. It’s as if all you try to do is pick arguments with people, and shut them up if they say something you don't like.

And the real question is have you even yet bothered to play Pandur’s scenario, so you can judge whether my comments and suggestions for improvement were appropriate?

What have you done to help the situation? Did you give him feedback? We're all eager to read your words.

[Erwin]

Pandur: Past the 1 hour mark now and thing going well. (2.57 to go.)

***SPOILERS***

After the preset rocket barrage (HARASS level with 15 minutes delay), 2 platoons have almost worked their way thru the western part of the central town. Arty has been called for the eastern part. But, am suspecting that there are actually few defenders there. Have brought up two of the Stugs, plus 2 of Co 2's Stummels(?) plus a platoon of halftracks. So, every time a US unit fires, they get it back in spades, and that's the last one sees of them. I have a full mech platoon of Co 1 inf in reserve. Some enemy arty fire, but it's inaccurate and ineffective. I don't think the US FO can see my units here.

After an hour of HARASS barrage (15 minute delay with the next heaviest arty) Co 1 has started to attack the eastern edge town. A team and two HMG's have entered the northenmost building. I intend to move through the town S to N with the rest of Co 1 moving parallel through the woods and supporting from there.

US mortar fire has been more accurate on this east flank and I have suffered about 6 casualties from one of the other HMG's firing from the treeline, and an unlucky inf team plus a breach team that were also in the woods line. I ran em deep into the woods when I saw spotting rounds, but, somehow (bad luck?) some shells still landed on em.

Co 3 is forming up in the center of the map several hundred meters north of the central town. But, am only using their Stummels and halftracks to support Co2's attack.

The final reinforcement of 4 Tigers is racing FAST up to join the battle. But, at this rate I do not think they will be needed until the final town objective on the N edge.

I won't say that it all seems too easy so far as I don't believe every scenario needs to be a desperate fight to the death. So, far, I feel I have more than enough forces, and I am enjoying using the minimum necessary while keeping a large reserve. There may well be ugly surprises later. The briefing mentions air. Have never played a CMBN scenario with aircraft before(!) And the German player has a LOT of vehicles and very little terrain to hide em in. We shall see...

I do cease fire every hour or so to get a feel for the effectiveness of arty. So far the Germans have suffered about 6 KIA and maybe 12 WIA, with about 4X as many US. So, about 2% German casualties so far. Those are numbers I like. Of course I am only 1/4 of the way.

PS: For scenarios like this that take a while to get units to where they have to fight I find it best to use HARASS with the max 15 minute delay. Harassing fire keeps the enemy's heads down and hinders movement. And it's economical with shells. If you don't really need it whe you get within small arms range of the objective you can cancel or adjust the arty and there is "if you done it right" still plenty of ammo left.

[LongLeftFlank]

Augh! Check fire! Check fire!

[Erwin]

Huh? I thought I was doing the scenario ok...

One question is that I still have a problem with enemy mortars - esp since I play WEGO. Whenever I see a spotting round land, I try to get everyone within maybe 20 meters of the impact to run away from it. But, am STILL suffering more casualties from this sort of fire than any other.

How far do you think one should FAST MOVE (or QUICK??) one's inf units away from a spotting round so they would be safe from FFE.

You guys have any rule of thumb??

[Mord]

Find them offensive? No. Annoying and self centered? Yes. Give me give me give me give me...

Of course they are paraphrased (who has time to look up two years or so of your complaining) but they are accurate.

Don't feel embarrassed for me...be embarrassed for yourself. People have been reading your whines and petty demands much longer than they've been reading this thread.

Nope. haven't played. Have you started on your scenario and mod making yet? You want me to show you how it's done with feedback...I want you to show us how it's done by ACTUALLY doing something. We all have heard how hard you struggle to play the game and use other people's content, how much work it is, how much sweat and blood and pain you've endured...so, show us how to do it right...so others won't have to suffer as you have. Release us from bondage...and while you are at it you can show all those crappy BFC artists and designers a thing or two.

There is no help for the situation, Erwin of Arc, just PAM in all its undying glory...Maybe BFC will saint you?

Mord.

[LongLeftFlank]

Mord, go back to the Bunker and cool off, man.

Take a little browse through the last 5 pages of Erwin's posts... you will find a large number of extremely courteous "Thank you's" and "Great works" with no backslap following. Including one such addressed to you and one addressed to me.

SBurke already manned up and stood down like a gent. Why can't you just do the same? The dedicated CM core is too small to slag each other like this. And I'm just not seeing any evidence of trolldom here. On the contrary, I have a long record of detailed, timely and useful feedback from Erwin. Each of the core team contributes in his own way.

[Mord]

There's nothing to cool off from...I am just arguing. But since you asked...I'll let it go...it's a waste of time any way.

Mord.

[Erwin]

For the record I admit I have absolutely no talent in graphics, and while I did enjoy making scenarios in CM1, the complexities of CM2 scenario design are beyond me.

I have however in a prior life been a professional board and computer reviewer and editor of a wargame magazine. So, when someone asks for feedback, I am more than happy to help them out.

Mord: If you had actually got off you high horse of indignation and bitterness and actually played at least some of Pandur's scenario you might have experienced what I was talking about. You may have even agreed with my comments.

As it is, you reacted with your screaming infantile fit over my feedback comments based on utter and arrogant ignorance. You were not even involved in the conversation. And nobody cares what you think, because you haven’t helped anybody with the issue at hand.

Every post you make that denigrates me and other people simply shows what kind of person you are. We're sorry for you, as trying to live a life, maintain a job, gf, wife etc. while spewing poison must be really hard. You pick arguments for the sake of picking arguments in the hope you can bully people into silence. And that's how you think you win. All you are doing is hurting yourself.

Pandur: If you would prefer me to stop posting feedback re your scenario then plz say so. If you are scared of being dumped on by Venom Spewing Bullies then simply send me a Private Message. I am quite happy to play games and not provide feedback.

I'll leave it to everyone to decide if what I thought was my generally positive feedback to Pandur earlier in this thread deserve this the following offering from Mord:

"If you didn't bitch or have a passive aggressive comment for just about everything anybody here ever does, designers might be apt to consider your viewpoint more openly. You are one of the most demanding dudes on this board. Everything with you is "work"...CMX2 is work...the scenario is work...loading mods is work. Thing is, you aren't doing any work...you are benefiting from the WORK other people do...and apparently nobody can do any of it well enough to satisfy you. It gets f*****' old."

[LongLeftFlank]

[Facepalm]

Like a bunch of old women! No, really, my wife's been feuding with a neighbour (formerly close friends) for a year now; all the sadder for Dad, since said neighbour is a blonde, pouty-lipped goddess with huuuge.. tracts'a land.

[Mord]

[Vanir Ausf B]

Lmao!

..........

[mjkerner]

[Facepalm]

Like a bunch of old women! No, really, my wife's been feuding with a neighbour (formerly close friends) for a year now; all the sadder for Dad, since said neighbour is a blonde, pouty-lipped goddess with huuuge.. tracts'a land.

Now THAT is a shame!

[LongLeftFlank]

Yeah, and our families were planning a beach vacation together too.....

So you SEE where this leads? DO ya?! huh?

[Erwin]

Hey, it's your own tag line, Mord: "Let's see, Mord. You rant, you scream as would a child, you throw little tantrums, you wantonly call others names . . . in brief, you generally conduct yourself in public like some unwashed and unread cretin..." I thought it was a joke, but apparently you enjoy it. Ok...

***SPOILERS***

This is really getting interesting now. About the 1 hour 25 minutes into the scenario, 2 platoons of 2nd company has just about taken the twin central towns for 250 points with minimal casualties. I got tired and carelessly let a Stug wander into the sights of an ATG that I knew was to the west. Despite a barrage, it survived and pranged the Stug. Other than that maybe another 5 or so inf casualties there. I am surprised that both engaged platoons are stilll in good shape and I have not yet had to commit the third platoon or 3rd Company.

In the east edge, Co 1 has a strong foothold in the northern buildings and is progressing south. Haven't had to use any breach teams yet. Saving those for the final objective.

Have ecountered some enemy unts, maybe a patrol in the woods, as Co 1's reserve platoon moves south. But, overall very happy with progress. It is very nice to have sufficient units and time to create reserves and focus on using the minimum amount of force to accomplish objectives. The next priorities wil be to kill the 3 ATG's that have been spotted, and the remaining 2 TD's on the hill to the west. (My arty killed 2 of the TD's, but the last two have been harder to destroy.)

Both here and in the center of the map, the US arty has been largey inaccurate and ineffective, always arriving several minutes after German forces have already moved on.

I really do recommend Pandur's scenario. It is very refreshing to play a big battalion-sized CMBN scenario. I hope others will try it as am curious as to whether you encounter different defenses.

[Sixxkiller]

I think you guys should go take a nappy. I am watching Bait Car. It makes me so happy when these idiots figure out that the police are about to lower the boom you know?

[Lanzfeld]

[Facepalm]

since said neighbour is a blonde, pouty-lipped goddess with huuuge.. tracts'a land.

Picture or it didn't happen!