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No, I guess the things are overdone. That is my opinion. If you cannot use your own harbor in the UK because of domination of the Kriegsmarine the balance is done.

ChrisAmadeusturn41.png

UK cannot attack 8 subs or more without antisub tech. You only can damage the enemy with 1 strength point. The readiness bonus in the counter turn give the subs a quote of 3:3 or 4:4 sometimes a slightly favor for the Axis sub. If you take in mind that sometimes the subs dive but vice versa not...take a look it is 1941 Octobar. The first tech I take was anti sub but I could not catch it in 1941. Simply take out 2 subs in the production queue and the things are much better.

In this game I did not made a major mistake just slightly bad odds and wheather. The last vessels are now on the run to USA. That is not a balanced issue.

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Hi Amadeus

How would it have been if the Italian navy wasn't there in your game, as I guess that Gibraltar must have fallen to the Axis to allow them to sail out into the Atlantic?

Also, where is the RAF and is it in a position (when the weather is better) to bomb the enemy vessels?

Things do look a bit rough but I wonder how much difference the Italians are making, and the RAF could make here.

Thanks

Bill

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I can tell you I am playing a game with Happy right now where I had 8 subs deployed... he and I fought it out... and as Germany... his DDs hammered the heck out of me. He lost 4 DDs and I lost 4 Subs in the end and was forced to pull back. I think it comes down to deployment. The problem in your game is both German and Italian navies working with the U-Boats. What happened to your carriers? They should make short work of any Axis fleet.

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Hey Abukede, 4 DD's for 4 subs. Looks like an advantage for the subs, isn't it?

@Bill: Yes, if the fleet were splitted in Italian and German fleet it would make a big difference. That is right. BUT, I have another GOLD match as Axis. There I dominate the allied fleet aswell as here. You ask for the RAF. Well the range isn't that much. At the moment when the US Navy come now it works better now. I assume it is the difference between +2 subs and +0 Antisub in combination with the combined Axis fleet and the lack of money at the beginning and the big readiness bonus at sea.

Still believe that this part could be rebalanced...sorry.

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Hasn't been a problem in any of my games, but my opponent knows I like subs and is blocking North Sea and English Channel, as well as Brest. Tried to break out once(level 2 subs), it was costly(lost one, 3 damaged), ...still....maintaining the threat, I'll update later, not into 42 yet. Gibraltar still UK's.

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That's why it is important for the UK-French fleet to cripple the Italian fleet before France folds- If the Allies do not do this, they face the consequence of a Spanish strategy and taking Gibraltar and uniting the German-Italian fleets which would be impossible for the UK alone to handle.

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Not so sure about that. Italy can protect her fleet if planned properly and if Germans decline Vichy, the French fleet comes in real handy. Not only that, UK can also make it mighty tough to take Gibraltar, so IMO, taking on the Italian flleet before the French surrender is a matter of give and take, careful planning is a must or things can go awry.

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What? Aesopo....you have a problem DoWing Algiers to save Gibraltar? Look, I'll hand it to you, a determined attack by the Germans will likely end in success, but the UK player can make life very difficult and it could go on for the entire game.

Preparation is the key and the ramifications to the East Front will likely be very distasteful to the Axis.

What is it worth to keep a scenario like Amadeus showed us from unfolding?

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I dont think the naval side is out of whack. The UK gets 5 carriers by mid 1943 - and a whole hatful of crusiers, BBs and destroyers. EVen with a fully tanked up Italian Navy joining with the Kriegsmarine the RN should be too strong for that axis combination. Bill's point about land based air is also valid.

If Germany loses U boats then the Brit player will just transfer the power if the RN to the Pacific and that will unbalance the pacific war.

No - leave it alone. As allied player either destroy the Italian navy early on, or dont lose Gibraltar. Fail to do either and the RN should certainly find it tough as your screenshot shows.

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