lhughes41 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 Hi, I played Patton version of SC quite a bit back in the day (PBEM). Just getting back into SC Global Gold after praise it has received at www.wargamer.com. I have a pretty good handle on europe given prior play but pacific, and in particular China, is all new to me. I reviewed the official AAR and also played around with various attacks in first turn or two against China. China seems much tougher then in the non gold version based on the AAR and comparing what the manual says one can do versus say the 5th chinese army near Wuhan and what can be done in gold. The readiness of chinese units like the 5th has gone to 90%! I find I can't damage it by and large and therefore can't reduce it's entrenchments. It's just too tough a nut. This kind of readiness, doesn't seem very historical, but leaving that aside, it sure strikes me that China is too tough now for a main thrust by the Japanese. My question than to those who have played Gold is do you concur? Or do you think a focus on China is viable? I sure hope so because if not it seems like it gets rid of an interesting historical option (focus on china more than historically). I was particularly disconcerted by the AAR description that show a very experienced played doing "well" operationally in china (killing an army a turn) and yet not really doing well strategically. I don't need to be told a strategy to win in china in Gold.. I just want to know if it is possible! Also I'm curious if folks think the current settings (reaadiness, general ratings,mmps) are very historical for china? Otherwise game seems great BTW and very glad I purchased it. p.s. i am playing on expert... just struck me maybe that is my mistake? perhaps that pumps up readiness etc? I was thinking playing at expert would prepare me well for playing against humans but maybe I shouldn't??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crispy131313 Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 China is crushable in Gold. I'm playing my first multiplayer match and I'll give you an update once I get rolling on how it goes versus a human player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaMonkey Posted January 22, 2012 Share Posted January 22, 2012 I'm not sure if China can be subued against a good player, it's really a tough go, I'm still working on it, jury is out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lhughes41 Posted January 22, 2012 Author Share Posted January 22, 2012 Thanks guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert Cater Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 There are going to be some adjustments regarding China in the first patch as there was an unfortunate MPP collection error introduced prior to official release and a few other items we are going to look at fine tuning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lhughes41 Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 Thanks for the heads. Chinese were overall looking like one of the more elite forces of WWII ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lhughes41 Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 What I would like to see out of the patch is that "go after china" is a viable strategy operationally but a tradeoff strategically. That is, if Japan puts a lot of resources and effort into china she should be able to beat up China fairly well.. on the other hand she will have drained resources that might have been used vs the yanks...on the other hand later in the game the lack of china attack and extra resources might balance... In short, 'go after china' remains an interesting but not no brainer option (either no brainer not to do or no brainer to do :-) ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeaMonkey Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I would summarize the possibilities for China vs Japan like this. If Japan does indeed sink enough resources into China, subduing the country should be possible with the exception of a few remote mountain/valley outposts and forces. So maybe, never a formal surrender, an armistice would be a better definition, advantageous to the Japanese. Now, if USA and UK provide ample resources, then Japan has a tiger by the tail, optional up to what USA & UK wish to provide. The possibility of a substantial Allied offensive in China should be a very real strategic decision for the Allies to ponder. A lackluster attention to the Chinese theater by the Japanese results in a stalemate. Chinese offensives without critical Allied help are largely a fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amadeus Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 There are going to be some adjustments regarding China in the first patch as there was an unfortunate MPP collection error introduced prior to official release and a few other items we are going to look at fine tuning. I assume the river bug prevent more casualties for the chinese Side too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lhughes41 Posted January 25, 2012 Author Share Posted January 25, 2012 River bug? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill101 Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Yes, there was a bug in the combat calculations so that attacking across a river was leading to more losses for the attacker and less for the defender than there should have been. It will be fixed in the first patch and I think Amadeus is right in that fixing it will help the Japanese a bit in China. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awen Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 was this bug present in strategic command 3 global conflict (vasnilla, not gold) as i am having a real hard time against china who have many rivers in between the fighting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amadeus Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 If I understand Hubert right then this bug happened only in GOLD because of a new feature for the editor. The hard time you mentioned in China in GC is mostly active because of the restrictive movement. This part is perfect in GOLD now because of the forced marsh feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awen Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 I have experienced problems surrounding china with enough units because some tiles are not movable to so a forced march will help me reach them i guess. I even have some units that are stuck unless they move to the front first then can move away, ive found some supply problems as well like a unit near hong kong unable to resupply. But i still thoink the main problem is the rivers and that will not have changed in gold, ive heard gold is harder to beat china than vanilla GC but i have not tried it myself, im not looking forward to trying it tbh because its tougher and i doubt thats just because of the bug. its too easy for the chineese to gain experience from the attacks i throw at them across the rivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yolo911 Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I have been away for a year. Just checked in to see if anything was new around here. I read about Gold. And then I read about how nothing had changed with China. i liked your game but I didn't like spending 90% of my time banging my head against a brickwall (China). Took all the fun out of it. I would like to buy the Gold version but only if there is some way to take China down a few notches so that I have a couple of MPPS to use for the rest of the war. China Front uses every unit and MPP that i get. So, is there some way, maybe the editor? I've never used it. Seemed way to complicated. I still can't figure out supply. But I digress. Can the editor tone-down China from a superpower? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill101 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Hi Yolo911 Welcome back, and for China, their economy can be easily reduced in the editor by decreasing their Industrial Modifier. This should enable the Japanese to make more headway against them, and save you from banging your head against a brick wall! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yolo911 Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Hi Bill, Industrial modifier. Okay I will try that. I would like to have enough MPPS to have a little fun with the Japanese. I have to devore all of my time and MPPS's to that theater and it becomes very tedeous and limiting. Thanks and I will try it. and it is good to be back. I may retire at the end of this year (35 years same place) and I imagine I will have enough time to try a PBEM game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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